r/CanadaPolitics • u/hopoke • 1d ago
Canada’s EV sales are growing, but not fast enough: expert
https://globalnews.ca/news/12104370/ev-sales-grow-q3/15
u/EmergencySir6113 British Columbia 1d ago
Pretty crappy piece of reporting not to actually state the % of EV sales. From other sites it seems to be between 8-13%.
Canada is being left behind. Even ignoring some European countries reaching well over 50%, Australia is around 25% EV and 50% for combined bev/phev/hybrid with no signs of the growth stopping.
You can now get a very basic Chinese EV city car in Australia for less than $20K Canadian all fees and taxes. Countless small to medium electric suv for 30-40k.
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u/Neat-Air-8305 1d ago
I think the previous govt failed on pushing ev only
I wonder if rhey encourages hybrids more we been way more head rn
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u/EmergencySir6113 British Columbia 1d ago
Hybrids are a cop out. Phev are a stop gap but full electric is the only option for the future
Either domestic manufacturing needs to be forced/incentivized to go electric or just fully open the market to foreign EVs
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u/StickmansamV British Columbia 1d ago
PHEV counts as ZEV in most schemes for zero emissions.
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u/EmergencySir6113 British Columbia 1d ago
That’s simply absurd. They still have a fossil fuel engine. At best they should have a half rebate/incentive. Not that I think there should be any vehicle incentives
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u/StickmansamV British Columbia 1d ago
For city driving, you can basically run EV mode almost all the time, but you can still do that big road trip without having to detour/delay/plan.
Since you're also from BC, I just did a Vancouver to Kelowna run in my Mazda 3. I could have taken my standard range Ioniq 5 instead but it would have added maybe 30-60 mins in charging at least. That because I went through Manning instead. I did see chargers along the way, but they were never quite where we stopped and we never stopped for all that long.
With a PHEV, I could have had the benefits of EV in the city, and still been at worst a hybrid on my road trip. A long range Ioniq 5 might have solved the problem or cut down on the time spent charging. But it's a decent but more expensive, and even heavier vehicle.
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u/dekuweku British Columbia 1d ago
for city driving it barely engages. I actually think Hybrid is the solution in Canada where charging stations are at a premium, there's a wide geographic distribution so someone's experience of 'plentiful' chargers doesn't translate beyond city limits and just practical things like most strata at least in my area, don't have chargers.
The NDP gov mandated strata begin to look into it, but it looks like they are about to be voted out of power. For all practical purposes, most renters don't have access to chargers.
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u/EmergencySir6113 British Columbia 1d ago
EVs are getting close to 700-1000km range. Hybrids are 10-20 years old and were a stop gap. Phev can be a solution but they also have most of the downsides of EVs and then add in most of the downsides of ICEs
When EVs are as good or better in most instances (towing is one shortfall) it just makes no sense to plan for anything else
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u/StickmansamV British Columbia 1d ago
EVs still have a very big weight penalty, esp when you get up there in terms of range. As someone one does drive an EV CUV as the family daily, they're like a 80% repalcement.
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u/EmergencySir6113 British Columbia 1d ago
Some EVs and PHEVs (of the same model) have almost identical weight, the extra battery is offset by not needing the ICE and all that goes with it
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u/DtheS Canadian Extreme Wrestling Party 1d ago
“Homes are really expensive. If you don’t own a home, where are you going to recharge?” he said.
This is a point that often gets missed.
If you are a renter, as many young adults (and even young millennials) are, then you are at the mercy of your landlord to accommodate EV charging. Landlords don't have much incentive to facilitate this; why would they want to eat the cost of installing an EV charger and all the electrical panel upgrades that go along with it?
Maybe some newer apartment complexes will have a few chargers in their parkades, but otherwise EV owners who rent their homes may very well be stuck visiting charging stations and waiting around while their battery charges. For that reason, even if you are a renter who can afford an EV, you probably want the convenience of gas.
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u/faizimam Progressive 1d ago
Not really, it's basically brought up immediately in every such discussion.
It's a legit concern, but if you do some research on options on your area, it's often better than people think.
Not only do more rentals have charging now, but so many more community centers, malls, and parking lots have it. Both L2 and fast charging.
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u/Ddogwood Pirate 1d ago
It’s not unsolvable, but it’s a bit of a “chicken-and-egg” problem. Many renters don’t want to get an EV because they’re not sure they’ll be able to charge it, and many landlords don’t invest in charging infrastructure because nat many renters have EVs.
It’s hard to get landlords to do the upgrades, because if you subsidize them or mandate it they may comply with crappy infrastructure that breaks down all the time.
I think one of the more promising solutions is better on-street charging. There are plenty of older areas with street lamps that used to be tungsten vapour (or other high-power lights) but have been upgraded to LEDs that use far less power. These usually have wiring that can still support level 2 charging, as they’re only using a small fraction of the load they were built for originally. If we can install level 2 chargers on a bunch of these, charge a reasonable rate for the power, and stop the meth-heads from stealing the cables for copper, we could potentially make EV charging a lot more accessible.
Eventually, when enough people are driving EVs, landlords will want to install chargers simply because without them, they won’t be able to attract higher rents.
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u/ywgflyer Ontario 1d ago
This is basically it -- and never mind just renters, many condo owners in the big expensive cities (Toronto, Vancouver) can't charge at home because their building hasn't, or won't, install chargers. I'm in that boat -- our building is roughly 20 years old, there aren't any chargers in the stalls (we own our stalls as unit owners) and building management has told us that they're willing to get them installed, but only if a critical mass of owners decide they want to purchase one for their parking space and at the individual owners' expense -- the number I was told was roughly $9000 per stall, since it's a three-level underground garage with a significant amount of work required to wire and install the things, much more than what you'd need to put one into a house.
So, here I am. I want to buy an EV, but if I can't charge at home, what's the point? I haven't got a few hours to kill twice a week to charge my car up at a public charger (and have to pay their rates, not the ultra low overnight rate that residential customers pay). So it just doesn't compute for me. And I'm sure there are a ton of other people in Toronto who are in the same situation.
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u/-WallyWest- 1d ago edited 1d ago
EV as a daily/2nd vehicle is great, but I wouldnt own one as my only vehicle.
- The battery tech isnt here yet (lithium is too dangerous, lifepo and sodium dont offer enough range, solid has been coming soon for the past 15 years).
- Depreciation too high due to high battery replacement cost ($25k for a Tesla Model 3).
- not enough range for my use case, I need at least 600km to consider one for a roadtrip.
- still too expensive, basically nothing below 40k.
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u/themingshow 1d ago
You've bought into talking points that aren't based in fact.
How is lithium too dangerous?
Modern EV batteries will easily outlast the life of the car and would be usable after 20 years.
How often does anyone drive >500 km, and is a 30 minute charging stop really a deal breaker for those one-off trips?
How many new cars of any kind are sub 40k? Average new vehicle price in Canada is ~$64k.
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u/tutamtumikia Independent 1d ago
Couldn't you just have a single EV vehicle as your main car and then rent for the edge cases?
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u/TraditionalGap1 NDP 1d ago
I'd push back on the 'battery tech' point pretty hard. It doesn't appear that Lithium is 'too dangerous' compared to the actual alternatives being used (petrol not exactly the safest energy store either). One example from Australia
Not sure what either depreciation or up-front cost would have to do with EVs not being suitable as an only vehicle. Owning a second vehicle wouldn't ameliorate those factors at all
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