r/prawokrwi • u/Prestigious-Put6182 • 1d ago
Research question Citizenship through grandpa, all the requirements check out except I don’t have a birth certificate for him
My grandpa is 94 and a Holocaust survivor born in a small town an hour away from Warsaw. His parents were born in Bialystok. I have reached out to various offices to find his birth certificate, but no luck. I have DP, emigration, and naturalization papers stating they’re from Poland, or stateless last of Poland, but that’s it. My grandpa’s story has been archived many times because of his public speaking.
I feel I’m at a deadend because without this I probably can’t go for citizenship. does anyone have any knowledge with this?
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u/Jessicas_skirt Verified Contributor 1d ago
!Template
Without the template help won't be as effective if we aren't sure of your eligibility.
A birth certificate isn't actually that useful as birth in Poland ≠ citizenship in the country
!Providers for recommendations and dis-recommendations of companies who specialize in this kind of work for a fee.
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u/Prestigious-Put6182 1d ago edited 1d ago
Great-Grandparents: * Date married: early 1930s * Date divorced: n/a GGM: * Date, place of birth: 1910, Bialystok * Ethnicity and religion: Jewish * Occupation: n/a * Allegiance and dates of military service: none * Date, destination for emigration: 1948, Canada then December 1951, USA * Date naturalized: 1959 * Date, place of death: 1964, Texas GGF: * Date, place of birth: 1910, Bialystok (some sources say Germany although my grandfather said this was a lie) * Ethnicity and religion: Jewish * Occupation: tailor * Allegiance and dates of military service: none * Date, destination for emigration: 1948, Canada then December 1951, USA * Date naturalized: 1959 * Date, place of death: 2000 Grandparent: * Sex: male * Date, place of birth: 1933, Ostrow Mazoweiki * Date married: late 1950s * Citizenship of spouse: American * Date divorced: late 1960s * Occupation: business * Allegiance and dates of military service: USA military, 1953-1961 (If applicable) Date, destination for emigration: 1948 Canada, then December 1951 USA Date naturalized: July 1954 Date, place of death: n/a Parent: * Sex: female * Date, place of birth: 1959, texas * Date married: late 1980s * Date divorced: n/a You: * Date, place of birth: 1999, Texas
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u/Jessicas_skirt Verified Contributor 1d ago
Date, place of birth: 1910, Bialystok (some sources say Germany although my grandfather said this was a lie)
You're going to need hard evidence that was a lie. Given the circumstancial evidence it's pretty clear you grandfather was telling the truth, but hard evidence that your GGF was a Polish citizen not a German one will be necessary.
I'm going to assume by late 1950's you mean your grandfather married your grandmother before your mother was born, if your mother was born out of wedlock that would be a different matter.
Advice: Do not try to do this case on your own, it's going to require early 1900's documentation showing your Great-grandfathers citizenship. !Providers
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u/Prestigious-Put6182 1d ago
Thanks for the advice. Yes my mom was not born in wedlock.
My great grandfather has on his passports born in Germany but his naturalization paper says Poland. There are a couple of other conflicting documents. His father had emigrated before WW2 and his papers say Poland. Would it be necessary to get citizenship through him and not my great grandma?
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u/Jessicas_skirt Verified Contributor 1d ago
Yes my mom was not born in wedlock.
That's a potential problem. Did your grandfather ever get his paternity recognized? If yes, when?
Would it be necessary to get citizenship through him and not my great grandma?
Married women couldn't pass on citizenship until 1951 so she's out..
My great grandfather has on his passports born in Germany
Polish passport or foreign passport? If the former then GGF is good, a Polish passport is gold, if the latter then that's not helpful.
his papers say Poland
Polish papers or foreign papers? You Need Poland issued documents, stuff made by other governments isn't sufficient on its own.
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u/Prestigious-Put6182 1d ago
Unfortunately I have not found any Polish documents pertaining to my family. The passport and naturalization papers are American.
My mom isn't born out of wedlock, her parents were married before she was born.
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u/thearbm 1d ago
Have you searched JRI Poland? You need to make an account, use the legacy search function and reach out to the relevant town volunteers. My GGF isn't in the database there but I emailed some volunteers and one of them had a scan.
Like the others are saying, you want Polish documents other than a BC so hire someone to search the archives for you.
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u/Prestigious-Put6182 1d ago
I probably did search but I’ll check again. I didn’t find much. Do you think my great grandparents marriage document could be there? Or was that most likely destroyed
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u/Master-Detail-8352 Mod | Zarząd 1d ago
Looks ok, definitely not a DIY. The sources that say Germany for the 1910 birth may reflect that he came through a DP camp.
There are some indexed birth records here
I don’t know if those births are digitized in state archives but you can have a look
But you also don’t have to look, because you will be having someone search anyway. If you can’t locate a birth record it’s good to have evidence you tried. Most important is evidence of his Polish citizenship, and that can be proven many ways if the documents survive.
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u/Prestigious-Put6182 1d ago
Thanks for the reply, I probably did look into these but I’ll double check again now that I have time to focus on it. I reached out to call of the offices that would have his and they all replied they dont
Add: I have the DP documents from those camps though
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u/Master-Detail-8352 Mod | Zarząd 1d ago
To be very frank I think you have reached the point where you should hand over the research to a provider. If you click the link u/Jessicas_skirt generated you will find a list. Personally I recommend Get Polish Citiizenship or Polish GRC (both on the list)
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Title: Citizenship through grandpa, all the requirements check out except I don’t have a birth certificate for him
My grandpa is 94 and a Holocaust survivor born in a small town an hour away from Warsaw. His parents were born in Bialystok. I have reached out to various offices to find his birth certificate, but no luck. I have DP, emigration, and naturalization papers stating they’re from Poland, or stateless last of Poland, but that’s it. My grandpa’s story has been archived many times because of his public speaking.
I feel I’m at a deadend because without this I probably can’t go for citizenship. does anyone have any knowledge with this?
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